Time to pay out the ex and really pissed about it.

I know how you feel. My ex is supposed to get half of my pension and profit sharing in which he promised he would never touch since I have MS.  Long and behold his lawyer convinced him to get half.  But I am very pig headed, we have been divorced for two years now and he still did not get my pension and profit sharing.  If he wants it let him make a motion to the court since he has violated everything in our agreement and if that is the only thing I violated let the judge order it.  He has done nothing so far so I do not even mention it.  I think he forgot about it.

The law to share half your retirement savings came about when a man died and left his retirement savings to his mistress whom his wife didn't know about.  When this happened, the law was enacted to protect wives so that any workplace savings is marital property.  We now live in an era where there are just as many women in the work force and many of us (women) have a nearly equal amount to lose to an undeserving spouse.   It would be more fair that retirement savings should not be shared in divorce where infidelity is the cause.  Since we don't have this protection against abusive and promiscuous husbands, we need to get pre-nups before we get married.  It's too late for me but I do advise anyone and all young people to get pre-nups while you're in love and before you say "I do".  It's easy to do when you're starting out and don't have anything.  Help me spread the word to all couples on the way to the altar.

As for you, you do have a right to be angry especially when you divorce because of infidelity, mental or physical abuse, and/or substance abuse and when a spouse just wants your savings.  Try as best you can not to dwell on it and be happy he's gone.

Ok, time for another man to chime in. I was happy to give my wife half of my pension, the piece of mind was worth every penny. We we married for 22 years of which 15 were extremely difficult. I can always make more money, but I value trust much, much more. The way I handled it was to offer 1/2 the pension and 401k right front, no strings attached. Once I realized that she was never going to change and had not desire to try, I was done emotionally. I became detached, which made it easier. I trust that their is a woman out their who will appreciate and have my best interest at heart. 

P.S.  I'm surprised I'm not seeing more posts from men on this issue.  This is stereotypically their venue.  ;)  Hurray for woman's lib?

I feel your pain. 

For most of  my 25 years of marriage I lived in relative poverty.  I was a full time at-home mom.  My husband insisted on it.  And he resented having to spending his money on mundane things like rent utilities and food for his family when he'd rather spend it on booze pot and camping trips for himself and his friends.  Things are better now that the kids are mostly grown and I have a job, but every payday is still a race to get the bills paid before he overdraws the checking account buying himself toys or taking out cash to spend on his mistress.  We both make good money but don't have a single cent in our joint savings account.

I found out the only way to save money was to hide it from him.  It started innocently enough.  I'd grab $5 or $10 on payday and hide it so I could buy milk and bread etc.for the kids if we ran out before next payday.  Now I'm saving up to move out. 

A couple of years ago I got a raise at work and didn't tell him about it.  Instead I put the money into the company 401K.  He's going to be pissed off when he finds out, which of course he will when I file for divorce and we do disclosure and discovery.  In our tax bracket it wouldn't have added much to my paycheck, but with the company match and stocks going up again I estimate there's over $25 in there for every $10 I gave up in take-home pay.  He'll still be pissed.  He'd have wanted that $10 in our checking account so he could spend it right away.  Delayed gratification was never his thing. 

Now I'm sure he's going to want half and he's probably going to get it.  The law says built the savings together, the fact is I built the savings in spite of him.  What can I do?  I'll just have to take the advice of the others here and think of it as the last sacrifice to get out of a bad marriage. 

JFox,

All good advice.  I agree with the people who say feel what you feel.  But know that this is the downside to divorce, especially in "no fault" or "equitable distribution of joint marital assets" states.  In your case it works against you, but again, how would you feel about taking 1/2 if the shoe were on the other foot, as one of the replies asked?

My point isn't to make you feel better.  It is just to tell you that I hear your pain and anger and appreciate it for what it is.  I hope that you can find a way to get past it and move on in your own life and begin your new life without the baggage from this marriage.  It is not easy, nor does it happen overnight.  For some (me included), it takes a long time to really feel that we'ver resolved our issues.  For others it seems to take less time, and I sometimes wonder whether it is because they never dealt with things fully or if their issues weren't as profound.

Good luck to you!

I know you don't want to hear it, but you really do have to get past the whining and move on. It's a cliche but it's true: "Anger is a poison you take hoping it will kill someone else." It is true that, yes, it is only money. It's also true that it isn't "your" money, it belongs to both of you in a marriage, community property or not. You chose the guy and you entered into a partnership.

As for whether he will blow it or not, why is that relevant? It's his money. Focus on your blessings and the fact that you are rid of the bum and let go. You can't enjoy your life until you do.

I hear ya.  I didn't have a 401 (K) to give him half of, but I do pay child support.  At first I was angry about having to pay that since he makes 2 1/2 times what I do.  Then, I thought about how when my daughter graduates high school, I will never have to pay him a penny ever again.....  I know my ex can't handle money, which was my original complaint to myself.  But, I know, in the end, I'll have a much better life without him.

When I get angry I let myself be angry. There's no point in stopping it. That anger helps wash out the pain from the wound he inflicted when he left.

Anger is just an emotion and is neither good nor bad. It's how you use it and whether it consumes you. Even compassion can be wrong if you don't let someone set bones for your kid out of compassion for the pain they'll have while it's being set.

So after I've screamed into my pillow or vented to a friend, I feel better. It seems to have less power after a few cycles of anger, ok, anger, ok. Trying to 'let it go' and 'move on' without first letting myself feel it doesn't work for me.

I'm reading people say "It's only money" and although that is true, you need money to live and survive. It's even worse when you have children to support or you are closer to retirement than the beginning of your career.

In many instances you CAN'T recover from the financial devestation a selfish STBX can cause to your finances.

I personally worked 15 years in extremely hard jobs and put aside 15% of my pay when most of the time I couldn't afford it. Now he wanted 50% of it. I ended up spending ALL of it on the divorce and I'm STILL not divorced. Talk about angry!

On top of that he refused to pay his half of the mortgage and 2nd mortgage and expected me to take care of it. The two mortgages together were more than I make in a month and I still needed to pay all the other bills, food and living expenses. We lost our house and he filed bankruptcy.

He hasn't noticed that there isn't any money. Proceeded to have a baby with the mistress and is having a blast at Disneyland. I just don't understand where all the money comes from! Someday the money really will run out...perhaps not until they are old and can't retire because they didn't save anything.

In the meantime I'm working my ass off to rebuild my finances and retirement. I'm going to retire on that sailboat like I always wanted and never would have had if we stayed together! I have a great goal to work towards and that helps a lot with the anger.

My ex went after half of my 401K thinking it was my retirement.  He knew he was entitled to half but since he was too stupid to hire a lawyer he only got exactly what he asked for.  The divorce degree stipulates that he has no claim to anything in the future to include retirement benefits.  My retirement plan was worth way more than my 401K and he was actually entitled to half of both.  It's been 4 years and I still don't think he knows yet.

He and his girlfriend blew through the $$ in a couple of months -- flying off all over the country going to concerts and staying in nice hotels that summer and then setting up house together.  They both walked away from marriages without anything except his half of my 401K so he impressed her with all this money and nice new stuff..  Now he's broke and she's looking for her next sugar daddy.

I say, it's only money.  I'm so much better off without him.  My freedom and sanity were worth what it cost me.  I've managed to put more $$ away in savings in the last year than I did the entire 21 years we were married.

Hi Jfox624 -

I understand how you feel.  I put my son's father through his last years of college and grad school, allowing him to earn the $100K+ in salary he gets today.  I paid the tuition as he wasn't earning enough to do so. 

I saved $40K vs his $10K while we were engaged so we could buy a house.  I saved another $10K when we were married in my 401K. 

When we bought our house we bought it from my folks and they gave us $40K off the price.  It wasn't a gift, them made us sign a note that was payable on demand.  They told him that this was not a gift if he and I didn't stay married. 

When we split and I bought him out of the house he wanted to ignore the $40k that my folks decreased off the price of the house.  He wanted his full half.  I had no proof of the difference in $$$ that we had put into the house initially when we bought it from my folks, so that wasn't even something I could look to recoup.  I had to give him $10K to settle the issue of the $$ from my folks or spend it in legal fees.  I chose to settle. 
He then agreed to the $40K off the price of the house.  He still got away with the difference in $$ we put down.  

Through all the years we were married he spent every penny he earned and lots of what I earned.  But I decided that being out of the marriage was worth whatever it cost financially because I couldn't tolerate the abuse any longer. 

I can always earn more $$$.  I can't get my health back if I let him control me with his abuse and manipulations any longer.  I made a decision to let the $$$ go and practice self care.  You must do the same.  You can always make more $$$.  You can't fix your health if you stress over this and get really sick or develop stress related long term illnesses...  high BP, heart disease, etc.

Make the decision to let it go.  It's not worth it.
Love yourself enough to practice self care.  
You can do it.

If you want to chat, I am here.
Best - 
Lisa 

illinois is a no fault state.  they couldn't care less if he cheated on you. mine did to and i have had him up on contempt twice now for not disclosing finacials on his homey arrangement with his whore and her two kids as well as delaying my payouts and the courts have done nothing. the assets get divided how the court deems fairly. you get 50% of any of his profitsharing as well as 50% of his pension during the years of your marriage. equally for him. whichever one is the lesser amount is usually deducted from the greater allowing it to stay in the orginal account and the balance is award to the rightful party. say he owes me 20K from his plan and i owe him 8K from my plan then he pays me 12K and i roll it over into my plan or pay taxes. or the other way around.

You have worked hard for your money and I understand the pain you are in, to think half of your defined contribution plan is going to fuel your pain.  No, it set you free.  You had to pay to get on with a life that you are deserving of (you & your son), not your ex) and should never have to pay for that.  But, let it go..it only consumes your healing from going forth. I am glad you vented your anger..I would feel the same way, but I want you to be free of someone who is so not deserving of you in their life.

Keep me posted for I care...

Peace to you!

I can not say that I understand how you feel.  However, you have every right to be angry.  Just don't let the anger take complete control of you, it's not good for you!  Let him take the money, it just that, money.  You'll make more and be even more prosperous.  Take this as a lesson learned in your future relationships.  I'm sorry that this has happened and he shouldn't want anything, especially if he decided you were no more good for him.  But as the old cliche' goes "it is what it is".  Don't sweat it.  Marriage is supposed to be about putting two resources together but unfortunately too many times the inclusion of both resources is unbalanced.
It is going to slip through his fingers like sand anyway because he didn't work for it and probably doesn't deserve it!

I do have one question for you.  Would you be as pissed about taking his money if the shoe were on the other foot, yours?

Thanks for all the good advice. Yes, I do understand that it is a marital asset, earned while we were married. But what sucks so bad is that yes, he cheated on me and at first, when we got the first settlement agreement written up, he didnt' want any. Then 2 days later he wanted 25%, then 2 days later he wanted 50% and then a few days after that, he got all belligerant and wanted 80% at which point I told him that once those pix of him and the skank hit the internet, he lost ALL his bargaining tools. So I would rather pay my atty (he chose not to get one) $20K in legal fees than pay him $20K to blow on that skank. The next day he backed down and said 50% was fine. But he is still getting waay more than he deserves in my book. And in Illinois, from what I have been told, if I had wanted to drag this out and spend more $$ in legal fees, if I have proof of his infidelity, he isn't entitled to any of my retirement, but I've been so hurt by all of this, I just wanted it over.

my ex is self employed and on paper I make more than him. for the last 8 years we kept all our finances separate…because he can’t control his spending and I needed to make sure we had enough money for bills. anyway, when it came to the part in the separation agreement about pensions and 401K he said “I’m TOLD that I’m entitled to half of your savings because you make more than me, but since we’ve been keeping everything separate I wont take advantage of that. What’s yours is yours and what’s mine is mine.” I know that was fortunate on my part.

 

I can still imagine how furious you are about having to give your ex half. In our case, my ex couldn’t manage to save a penny and was never worried about retirement, I was on pins and needles waiting to hear what he expected to get.

 

It’s a bitter pill to swallow, but as others have said at least from this point forward your ex can’t touch another penny of what you save.

(sorry, I meant to put in a paragraph break there, not change it all to bold)

We had a difference of opinion on our retirement accounts. We had cashed in mine to buy our first home. Now he has a large one and he doesn't want to split it with me. I had offered to let him take it if he would give in on certain issues. He's walking away with it AND several thousand dollars in cash.

If it's any consolation, if he cashes it in, he will have to pay tax on it as if it was regular income. Plus (I think) a 10% penalty. Plus more if he doesn't have the taxes withheld from it when he cashes it in. You're right, he doesn't deserve to get your money... but he will pay a large penalty if he does piss it away.

Be glad he is OUT of your life. That is enough to get you past the anger. You will NEVER have to fork out another penny to the sorry ex.

I know that feeling but on a bit of a different level.  My ex  left me for someone else who has quite a bit of money (Yes she's a gold digger), and I pay quite a bit for child support and health insurance.  I know what her bills are and the two amounts don't jive at all.  Not only that, I have the kids at least 3-4 times a week and every other weekend.  Where is my child support going?  I seem to see her in new dresses, clothes, or shoes all the time.  They go on vacations and I'm sure she buys that fat bastard nice things too.  The only way to get over that is to completely get it out of your mind or it will drive you crazy.   Having faith in karma kicking some ass later on is also a nice help.

It's not fair and why is it that good people always suffer in these situations?

This is a tough one.  It's probably hard to listen to my advise but the internal anger is very harmful to you and there's always more money.  Maybe now you are free to pursue a career that brings happiness.  There will be an upside. 

hey, sorry you have to give up half of what you have worked so hard for.  I can only imagine how hard this is.  I have been w/the same company for 19 years and have a pretty decent amount of $ in my 401K.  My stbx has had 5 different jobs during the course of our marriage.  Fortunately for me, he says he does not want 1/2 of my 401K.  I guess because he feels guilty for cheating on me, who knows.  I just hope that he keeps his word on that - our divorce isn't final yet.  Do the best you can to let it go.  You know you can't change it.  Let yourself feel the anger, because it is there and it is real.  Just keep reminding yourself that he can never touch another penny that you earn.  Stay strong.  It sucks but this too shall pass.

i am still waiting to see a penny of the 401K my ex OWES me. we were married before he began his job, which he got because of friends of mine. he pissed away every available dime WE ever saved because we both worked only i was not employed by a company that offered a pension or profit sharing plan. when WE went thru lay offs, union strikes, his drunken call offs and recoveries and every optional operation he could get so he didn't have to go to work, i still worked and worked doubles to make the bills and support US.  while you seem to feel you are entitled to 100% of this money you seem to forget you were in a MARRIAGE. think of it as its other discription, a legally binding partnership. and when a partnership is dissolved-thru either of your actions-then there is a pay out. assests are split, sold, reassigned or pissed away. except at that point you are in control of the portion you have left. that is a lot more control than we had as a couple with an irresponsible partener. redirect your anger at the reason your marriage is no longer. it will be about as productive as ranting about how you resent giving up the lawful portion of your JOINT assest that you promised your partner when you made your vows. i am assuming as you are on this site the divorce was not your idea and you have been hurt. i am sorry. all i can say is we would all be in better places if the young are taught as much about maritial responsibilities and pre-nups as they are about sex and alcohol and drugs.

i had a few differant 401k i had to cash out before myx left
but when she made money in 08  she sharred nothing with me so i feel ur pain  i gave up every thing to her an she walked away clean