Out of Love 

I'm sorry you're going through this now. How'd counseling go? I might have missed something.

I agree, it doesn't take much from friends and family telling her to end the marriage, for that to have a big sway on everything, as I know you know already.

Honestly, though, maybe it's better to get out of a situation where her friends and family all want her to leave you. I doubt any of that is based on reality or logic, which means that it's even more difficult to change their opinions.

It's difficult to admit this here, but my ex's family liked me less and less as the years passed, and holidays and vacations got so unpleasant that I couldn't even figure out why I was on Mau'i, in a penthouse with a panoramic view, crying and feeling like there was nothing left for me to do.

I think it's important to do everything you can to save the marriage, 'specially for the kids, but if she doesn't want to/isn't sure she wants to/is that susceptible to being swayed...well, that speaks volumes.

Also, this isn't like test driving a car, even though a lot of stbx's seem to believe otherwise. My ex went back and forth, at one point he even wanted us to get together for a spell, just to "see how it feels." Needless to say, that was a bad suggestion and led where you'd expect: "I'm still not sure, but I don't think so."

Which is right where we were before. But once I indicated that *I* didn't want to get back together, suddenly his advantage evaporated.

We're all pretty much screwed, being the one who isn't the one to break things up. The very nature of our position initially puts us into a defensive and reactive posture, since it's the other person who's initiating the action and theoretically has a better understanding of what it's all about. That said, I'd still much rather be where I am where he is, with all that new baggage to worry about.

JoJo your marriage and wife is down the crapper. Just reach on back there and flush. Swoooossshhhh. Now that it is gone get out in the world and start living in it. Get your life together and leave this chick in the dust. She is going to drain every ounce of life out of you if you let her. My wife is doing the same thing. She and our twelve yr old have issues and she cannot accept her role in that. Well, now she says that we cannot control what happens in our lives. I said oh really you mean you couldn't choose better friends? You couldn't keep your pants up?? You couldn't control your tongue and tell your boyfriend who got you knocked up that you were married? You couldn't put your family and marriage first?? So as screwed up as my stbx is I know yours is too. Remember the slogan "That hoe had to go" so pull your pants up and straighten your tie and get rid of that sick chick. You will be so much happier and you will find a chick that is able to be what all you need in a woman.

I read your text excerpt and I've gone through round and round crap for the last 2 years with my ex.  It's all garbage really.  She feels guilty and has no way of relieving that guilt.  She will string you along until you finally crack.  My ex left me for some other guy.  She strung me along for a year and a half and decided we could give it another  chance.  3 and a half months later she was back with the guy she left me for and it was like I had reached the edge.  What I thought was once my beautiful best friend, is now someone who make my stomach turn at the thought of.  It takes time and patience to get through this -- neither of which I felt I had.  But, there's a light at the end of the tunnel and you too will see it.  Have faith and stay strong.  This part of your life will test every fiber in your body and when you get through it, you'll be 1000x smarter and better off.

JT

Sorry to hear what your going through, hopefully you can find some resolve in this no matter what the outcome. There's a lot of good responses and their quite constructive as well. Be sure your going through this with the best of intentions. In other words, you need to make sure your not hiding anything or holding anything back (basically telling lies). If your holding something back (just as she found out you had a night of fun in Vegas with a hottie), then she truly might know about this, but again its just an example. Now that your willing to communicate and open up, and it seems that you are, its up to your wife to do the same. Her responses in the txt msg is pretty common and generic, hinting that she would rather burry than to confront the problem head-on. She might feel the need to bury the problem since your in a stressful situation. I am telling (as others have), you need to get the hell out of your sister-in-laws house ASAP and get your own place even if it is temporary. Nothing good can come of the situation and it will probably make matters worse. External interferences such as an in-law (especially the parent-in-laws), always put more pressure on the situation. Your wife may not realize this, but you need to step and make a command decision here. I hope your couseling sessions go well. It seems that there is a major breakdown in communication and that needs to be repaired. I am sure that there's quite a bit that needs to change and be addressed. Sure, a marriage once your in it for a while will never have those same initial sparks. But thats not an excuse to stray or just fall out of love. Good luck and keep us posted.

Thank you, thank you, thank you to all of you. I appreciate every single comment and it is helping me stay sane. I would like to take guilt trip's advice but I don't think I am that strong and just brush off the things that are going on around us. These things are part of our lives, and it's so hard for me to just ignore them. Another side of me wants to just pack my stuff and call it quits, but then I can just imagine the devastation in our children's faces. Counseling was supposed to have been last Tuesday but had to be postponed due to some scheduling error. It's now for this coming Wednesday the 14th.

I have no soul out here I can talk to since we just moved from California out here, my family and friends are all out west. She has everybody here, her whole support system.
I am truly grateful for all your comments and I do value all of them. Thank you!

Hi Lisa, yes I have read your comments and value them very much. I have not been able to get us out of the hellhole since she doesn't want to leave her sister. She says that's not the problem we are having and with us moving, the problem would not get solved. I have tried time and time again but she just would not give us the chance to heal alone without having her sister around.

Hi JoJo -

You posted about two weeks ago that all this began when you and your family moved into your sister in laws house in a new state.  At that time I had written to you, suggesting that you move your family out of your sister in law's home asap. 

Have you been able to do that yet? 

It appears that your sister in law has had an extremely negative influence on your wife.  Your last post indicated that she has become a vastly different person since your family made this move.

Please don't under estimate the influence that your sister in law can have on your wife.  I have seen clients family issues tear their marriages apart.  Although it is important for you and she to get into counseling, I think it is even more important that you leave the place where the poison lives. 

Remember, misery loves company and all it takes is someone she values (her sister)whispering garbage in your wifes ear on a consistent basis for her attitude to change. 

Please tell me that you have moved your family out and gotten your own place,  please.

The part that the so called "grown ups" don't realize is that the kids see both sides of the mom and dad relationship/interaction.  Put the kids firsts and you will do well, stay as calm as possible in front of the kids and be well.

If your wife is willing to go to counseling, get there as soon as you can.  I think that there are few problems in a marriage which can't be fixed IF BOTH (emphasize both) are willing to try to fix them.  However, no matter how small a problem is, it can't be fixed, if one is unwilling to try.  If she's unwilling to go or to try to fix things, go yourself.  A counselor can help you deal with what is going on.

...it

However I do wish you luck because it seems as if you really want to continue this marriage no matter what. I just dont want to you be the fool in this relationship. becareful and love freely, not madly.

Now i love what mtnvly posted. Maybe that is what happened. Love does not leave overnight and if it does then it was never there. I am still undecided about divorce myself. I am trying to do any and everything possible to make things work but unfortunately nothing is working. Everyone keeps on asking me whats wrong and when I tell them my story they have nothing to say and it yes it does kind of irritate me because it makes it seem like they are just being nosey. I have told my wife that I am not happy several times and even went and talked to the pastor that did our wedding and even he was shocked. When I found out what I found out I was shocked and betrayed because the news could have been told to me before we said our vows and I didnt need to hear about it *through the grapevine*. Ive told people on here my story and ive only gotten rotten replies saying its my fault for not loving her like i did and i shouldnt feel this, blah blah blah. I understand some of that because I did make a vow to love n honor her through sickness and in health. But when she tells me how she feels, ill be damned, i do everything I can to make her feel happy even if its not even my fault. But when I tell her how I feel, its always this. "if you want to leave just tell me" or "do you need to go live with your mothers for a while". It seems to be in one ear and out the other with her and I do want that marriage that when I come home from work i get the love and feeling of being loved I got before we got married. Apart from her watching the children while I am at work thats nothing because I work nights and she works days and I watch our son while she is at work and I only get 4 hours of sleep because of the time I get off work. But love is something mysterious and I have yet to understand it. I do know everything should be in writing from A to Z when someone gets married so there would be NO surprises because im trying to stick in there, but i wonder sometimes is she or is it really worth

My ex hit me very unexpectedly with the "I just haven't been happy for the past like 3 years." Could he have said anything? Granted, our marriage wasn't fabulous or anything. But I gave him his space and he gave me mine. The problem I think is that, because he had his own business, seasonal, he was off from Nov-April, while I worked full time year round to keep benefits and money coming in. That gave him lots of time in the winter to be a rat, which is what it turned out he did last winter. He met a woman behidn my back and even had her to our house while I was out working. Did he "suddenly" fall out of love? I doubt it. But once I found the pix on teh internet he was gone, right in the beginning of his busy season. Gave him 1/2 the money in the savings account - which was plenty to live on - and kicked him out. He moved 1 1/2 hours away just so he could be near the woman who was "just his friend". My ass. Now she is basically living with him. He was vulnerable and allowed her to tell him how much of a victim he was in every way possible (couple of medical things went on) and I wouldn't allow that. I told him to pull himself up and get to the docs and get stuff fixed, no matter what it cost (one procedure cost $14K out of pocket but that was okay - we paid). And in the end, I was the bitch cuz I didn't "sympathize" with him. Well you know what? Now he is headed straight down, he is a raging alcoholic and this woman is blowing his $$ faster than he can earn it in his company. So he is getting his attention from this woman, but it doesn't sound like he likes what his life turned out to be too much from what our son said. He didn't fall out of love with me, he just replaced me with someone who told him what he wanted to hear. And that isn't life and it isn't reality. So now he is in way over his head and trying to get out and I'm surviving. Not financially where I was 6 months ago, but I can support myself and our son and do just fine cuz I've got my head on straight.

well now you are talking about great guys hahah.In my situation i had that too, but with lots of emotional abuse, controlling on his part, demeaning and disrespectful in home as in the public...but he swears he does love me;) ookey??  i get it...no roses, no love poems   for a simple reason that I don't want to always look my best, waiting for him in the bed full of roses and a romantic dinner;)  UNDERSTANDABLE .....Sometimes guys and not only forget that even tho they are doing everything like they should around the house it doesnt intiltles them to take advanage and be a pig just because they doing all of that work.  You have to treat the person you with like you would your best friend!!  meaning there are things you would never say to your friend on the street because you know is just rude...so why would you say them to the person you live with, you swore to love and take care off?    And MOMI...that superlove with partners being apart for years....They just didnt live together , creating in their minds the perfect picture.it's normal i suppose...every relationship veries   GOOD LUCK TO YOU ALL.... i know my love was killed by my perfect husband who forgot to love and respect his wife:/ not to sound too bitter;)

I think we all know by now that communication is the key. But it has nothing to do with love. We might have heard of the stories of long lasting love between two lovers who were apart for many years with no communications in between while still in love, what do we call that then? Superlove? I am not being sarcastic or even implying, forgive my writing because it doesn't transfer the expression on my face or tone of my voice. This is a very constructive discussion. But let's look at it from the men's side, again I am not representing men here just my humble opinion.

Don't you think when men are working around the house, wrestling with their teenage boys, going to their softball games, fixing the bathroom light, mowing the grass or doing even an as-ordinary-tasks-as going to the same bed, night after night after night don't have love? Have we stopped to think what drives it then if it is not love?

This love might not be as glamorous as going to her work place at noon taking a red rose, or a candle light dinner for two, furnishing her pathway with rose paddles, or a vacation for two, but hey...I have bills to pay, plan to make for my son's college, retirement on the corner, a bad ass boss, zillions of things hanging in my head loos on my to-do-list, to fix and repair and move and switch and read and pay and....
...mid-life crisis? as one brilliantly and precisely mentioned? That might be very well the case.

Damn, I wish I had an answer for you JoJo, or even some advice, but the truth is, I don't. Mine ex pushed and pushed on us getting married. I am still trying to sort it all out about the whole " I don't love you anymore" six months after we wed and my leaving everything to move with him half was across the U.S. for ' his job'. I mean, 6 MONTHS......

I would have stayed and worked things out, but he was adamant about wanting me out, wanting a divorce, and that he didn't love me anymore.
Basically said " There is nothing to work out" He refused to try or go for counseling with me.  Didn't make any sense to me then, doesn't still. But, I do know he went back to the woman he cheated on me with and swore he didn't love......and married her 5 weeks after divorce was final.( wife #4) ...go figure....

Well i see the guys like the post about woman being mature or immature about the love and relationship...I get it.  But have you ever stop to think that you guys by not listening to us when we do talk and ask for little things of affection or little help etc we are trying to communicate?  I understand that after like with me 10 years, love is not so crazy and things become boring but if there is no basic stable fundation or true friendship love dies...hurt and anger takes over and some people leave knowing that they will never feel happy.....IT's excualy sad .I think that she got to the point of that immature love going away and in the crossroads of what's left?  Couples that stay together after that point should know that they have true , strong basic foundation for any realtionship....friendship, they like each other, respect, loyalty......  The couples that split had non of that...propably fell crazy in love, very sexual, obsesive, controling, or other wrong reasons why they did like each other...and what they have left after comming to that point of not feeling so in love is .....NOTHING.... they loved each other but not liked enough to stay together...Saddly a lot of us are tickled by the wrond things in life and we don;t even pay attention to very basic trades that build a friendship as with a friend not a mate:(

Mid life crisis?

I like the comments in this post and your post relates to my situation very well. I am in the same boat. When I look back I see myself also the cause of problem. However as some mentioned here there are two types of love, mature and immature. Love changes in a married life.

My wife didn't tell me about how she felt about our marriage and here comes my part, and I didn't probe deep enough to see the signs. This doesn't happen over night but some women are specially good at hiding it. Bottom line women who leave like this hold no value for marriage. So you can either sweep her off of her feet and go through the same cycle again (because she is not mature enough) or learn your lessons and move on. I know how exactly you feel but don't feel rejected or put all the faults on your own shoulder. Don't think too much about it either since there is no mathematical model that can formulate love and predict break-ups. I wish there was one.

Good luck!

sorry."who LEFT their husbands or bf".... not loved:/

Ok....   :) no woman in love will leave because they want more money!  lol  That doesn't happend!!  A girl that will leave for richer man is not IN LOVE or truely UNHAPPY because of the guy she is with.  I don't know ANY women who loved their husbands, BF because they wanted more money;)

Sorry, I just read someone else's post and need to comment on it. There are different kinds of love and the kind of love that keeps a marriage together is not the romantic love you read in a smutty paperback. If you have that kind of love in your marriage, you are 'the man', or you are young and good looking, one or the other. Who looks at a new-born baby and says, hey look how good looking my baby is, I think I'll love him/her???? No, no, no! You need to have that deep, anchoring love that holds families together, that thrives in the face of adversity, that scornes those who would try to break the family apart. Romantic love is like the icing on the cake, the key word being cake. If there's no cake, what do you have? A pile of sugar that melts away with the first rain drops.

Hey Jojo,
You gotta understand how some women think and I will qualify that statement with "SOME" women before I get a gang beat-down by all the wonderful, stable, giving women of this website. Some women are like childish business people. They look around as young women at the older women driving the new Benz, hair, nails, and make-up perfect, expensive cloths, and get this idea in their head and say to themselves, "hey, that's who I want to be". They just need to find a man who they think will take them there. When they see that they are not on that path or the road gets a little bumpy, they step back and say no, this is not where I want to be and suddenly, they are no longer in love with you.
Ladies, you can say what you want but I know a couple of these women. 
So, Jojo, don't sweat it. If she truly loves/loved you, counseling will do a world of good and you will get your honey back. If she's just materialistic, you might be better off letting her go.

I just read what i wrote and ....OMG  hahaha.sorry for the grammar

Something was wrong for a some time and it does take a moment, a little thing to just make someone run away and feel like they don't want to try or live that life anymore....Im very sorry......your best bet is to stay very humbled and show her how kind and sweet and carring you are without being forcefull and needy....  The biggest mistake people make is when they try to get mad and angry that they are beibg left behind...Makes the other person feel like they just want to completely dissconnect and cut all strings.  Just thing about this way.........if she doesnt love you anymore make her...let her fall in love with you again!!  Be like you would be at the begining of the relationship....be flirty, sweet, not demending, FUNNY, make her laugh, when she says she is going to bed and doesn't want to talk serious stuff say simply sure and..........don't call.  let her miss you , give her time to be alone because you will not force her into wanting you!!!  dont cry, dont be mean, dont ask milion questions...all you can do is to try to sweep her off her feet again.  If it doesnt work, nothing would and you will her the feeling like you have done everything and you can peacfully move on with time...Im sending you hugs and try not to get too depressed and get out there and dont tell her what you do unless she asks and be quick and short woth you rstories but yet super sweet;)  be the guy every girl would loveeeeee:) good luck

No one just falls out of love - I really don't think you ever stop loving them if you REALLL loved them! I think sometimes the hurts create wounds and if the hurts don't stop- the wounds don't heal and the love gets covered up.
You need to continue the conversation with her. You can't read between the lines. You need to know wth she is talking about-and the sooner the better. Letting it go only makes things worse . If you are like me you will play it over and over in your mind- and get nowhere!
Find some time to talk to her- Suggest counseling-for both of you! Together and apart!